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Saturday, June 30, 2018

T.I. Discusses The Origins Of Trap Music, Ye Vs. The People & The Dime TrapFor The Record



T.I.: I did found and present trap music first.
I did not alone get it where it is right now today. There were other people who made very significant
contributions to it, that took it places that I didn't, that did things for it that I hadn't. But I started it. Rob Markman: What's up geniuses? Welcome back to For the Record.

I'm your host, Rob Markman. Now, today's guest is just one of the
illest rappers to ever do it, alright? He has number one albums. He has number one singles. Bars for days, okay.

He's a label head. He's an actor, a fashion label designer, and
he has a new show on BET titled The Grand Hustle.' Oh yeah, and if you act up he still might
whip your ass man. I'd like to welcome to For the Record, the
King. T.I.: No, no violence.

T.I.: You know people sue nowadays, man. You gotta keep your hands to yourself. Rob Markman: We gone take that back Tip, man. Rob Markman: How you doing man? T.I.: I'm chilling.

How about you? Rob Markman: I'm doing good man. Congratulations, man, new show on BET, The
Grand Hustle. Rob Markman: We all gone be tuned in it. It's really interesting to me because when
you look at your career and the duration of your career and all the things that you
do, I try to rattle off and give a picture of everything that you did throughout your
career, and this feels impossible.

Your hustle is kind of unmatched. You're the perfect guy to get on TV and give
game to a new generation. T.I.: Man, I appreciate the opportunity to
be here to be available, you know, to try to just offer some insight, or some helpful,
guiding tips on how to get from where people are to where they want to be. That's flattering.

It's a honor to do that. Rob Markman: What was the moment for you coming
up? When did that change happen right? Because hip hop is such a beautiful thing. I think most artists, you come in, and when
you're really serious about your craft, you come in just wanting to be the best rapper
... The best at your craft.

Rob Markman: And then, when you accomplish
that, all these doors open. And we seen it with you. We seen it with Jay-Z. We seen it with Dr.

Dre. T.I.: Sure. Rob Markman: We seen it with Diddy. At what point, if you could pinpoint the moment
when your eyes opened up, and was like "Man I could take everything that I may have learned
in my previous life before rap, and now that I rap and my talent is here, that I can open
all these other doors for me and people around me?" T.I.: Probably somewhere between, I'm Serious,
and Trap Muzik.

You know, when the first album didn't really
work as well as I had hoped, or we'd hoped or expected. You know what I'm saying? Like the process of us pulling it back together
and not waiting on the label to do nothing, but actually putting our boots on the ground
and operating as an independent label. You know, I think that that was probably the
first moment for me. Rob Markman: So you started realizing you're
more than a rapper and you can do more than? T.I.: Nah.

I realized that, that there was a dire need
for more than just rap. I couldn't sit back and wait on somebody
else to fulfill that need. I had to get out there and we had to mobilize
ourselves, align our efforts to do it together. Rob Markman: I remember man, and it was around
that time, that really made me a real, kind of fan of yours.

I was the type of kid coming up, I'd buy everything. Rob Markman: If there was a single that I
liked, I'd get the whole album. T.I.: Right on. Me too.

Because you a hip hop hit. Like it's things that's just undeniable. It's in your DNA. You had a joint with Beenie Man.

It was your first single produced by the Neptunes. T.I.: Yep, I'm Serious. Rob Markman: On I'm Serious, yep. And I was digging that, so I said, "Man, I'm
going to get the 'I'm Serious' album." T.I.: I appreciate that.

You are one of the 14,000 that staggered into
the record store and bought it the first week. Rob Markman: I aint say I got it the first
week now. T.I.: Damn. We still got to find out who those 14,000
was.

Rob Markman: I don't remember when I had bought
it but I remember I copped it. Being in New York, I wasn't around for it,
because there was a mixtape grind to it. It was a real street-level, boots-to-the-ground
grind with the "Dope Boyz" record and that whole movement. T.I.: Sure.

Rob Markman: If I'm being honest, as a
fan, being in New York, you had kind of fell off my radar for a minute. This is pre-internet where everything just
wasn't accessible. And I heard you give an interview on Hot 97
in the lead up to Trap Muzik. And, really, what made me a fan was just the
way you was talking about that independent hustle, that go-get-it and how you restarted
your whole career.

I said, "Man, I got to go check it." And I liked "24." So I was probably gonna buy the album anyway,
and maybe get Trap Muzik. And it was over after that. T.I.: Hey man, I truly appreciate it. That was 15 years ago, man.

August 19, 2003. That was 15 years ago. Rob Markman: So we got a anniversary we got
to celebrate, man. Rob Markman: What about these candidates on
The Grand Hustle? Are they music people? T.I.: Some of them.

Rob Markman: Who did you pull from? Who are these cast of characters that we get
to see? T.I.: The one thing that I had absolutely
no hand in, was the selecting of the cast. I didn't view them, approve them. I hadn't seen them before you saw me walk
in that room. That was our first time meeting.

Just quite honestly man, they come
from all walks of life. They have different backgrounds, different
experiences, different ambitions. But they all gone have to serve one purpose. Rob Markman: The king.

That's that King talk, man. It's good. It'll be interesting to see, man. Because I think you really are ...

As successful
as you are man, very relatable. People see your success and it inspires us
to believe that we can do it ourselves- T.I.: Well you can. I'm living proof that you can. Ain't no real difference in where I came from
than where anyone else came from.

Maybe the timing of when we had to endure. But for the most part, if I can make it out
of what I made it out of, anybody can do anything. Rob Markman: You definitely made waves. I want to talk about some music, too.

Because man, you're just one of the greatest
to ever do it. T.I.: Thank you. Rob Markman: And the musical moments that
you've provided for us have been endless. Be it, Trap Muzik, be it records like,
"Swagga Like Us", be it like, King, Again, going back to the record store, I remember
King, and ATL being out in the same week.

T.I.: Yeah. Rob Markman: Whitney Houston ... Like, we
hadn't seen that type of movement. That was the first time I think, I went to
the record store.

And that one, I went to go get the first day. The Friday it came out. T.I.: That's what's up. Rob Markman: And Best Buy was sold out.

I didn't get King the first week. T.I.: Damn. Rob Markman: I went to go get it, but they
was sold out. T.I.: Back then, they came out on Tuesdays.

Rob Markman: Right. It was Tuesday, that's right. T.I.: Yep. I mean, man, that was another milestone in
my career, to release an album on Tuesday, and a movie on Friday.

That's something that hip hop hadn't seen. I'm just proud and happy that I was able
to achieve such levels of success. And you still been giving us these musical
moments. Earlier this year you collaborated with Kanye
West.

T.I.: Yeah. Rob Markman:  On "Ye vs. The People". It was one of those records, not a hit record
by any means, but one of those moments when every hip hop fan had to listen, had to get
a little closer to they speaker and figure out what was going on.

T.I.: It was a moment for the culture. I mean, honored to be a part of that moment. I think the discussion was an important one,
and it still is. And I think that using that piece of art as
a platform to kind of break the ice on some much needed dialogue that could possibly bring
people together to work for change.

Because it started as a conversation between
you and him, and then it was a conversation in the world. Did you know that it was going to release
in this way-? No. I had no idea. I never thought he'd let it out.

I never thought he'd release it to the world. I just didn't. But, I was wrong. I mean, hell, you know.

24 Hours later, it was out. Rob Markman: You're not used to working. I'm not used to it. But it don't bother me.

T.I.: You know what I'm saying? To be able to be that flexible, and move kind
of, I guess, at the speed of opportunity like that, I admire that. Rob Markman: It kind of made sense to me when
I heard that he got you on it, and the construction of the record, because it reminded me of a
record that you had done. You kind of mastered that style of record
with, "T.I. Vs T.I.P", the actual record on Trap Muzik, where you have a by-yourself
conversation where you going back and forth.

T.I.: I produced that record as a matter of
fact. Rob Markman: I'm trying to picture you on the beat machine. T.I.: I can still produce some heat. It gone take me a few beats just to get reacclimated.

Then it also would depend on what kind of
equipment we use. So what was your weapon of choice back then? T.I.: Was it the MPC 3? T.I.: MPC 3, and it was the ASR ... Rob Markman: ASR-10? And, the Phantom ... Rob Markman: Okay, yeah.

Triton was out, Phantom was out. Rob Markman: There were these big keyboard
sounds. That's what I use. Finna give Just Blaze a run for his money.

Rob Markman: I saw you and Just Blaze were
together recently, man. T.I.: Yeah, man. Rob Markman: Anymore heat coming? T.I.: Yeah, we were working on "The Dime Trap". T.I.: Yeah.

It's coming, freakishly soon. T.I.: But yeah, "T.I. Vs T.I.P.", Man, I produced
that record, and I think that conversational style of delivery, it came in handy for "Ye
vs The People," definitely. Rob Markman: You mentioned "The Dime Trap,
and I want to get into that, but I want to talk to you about ...

You dropped a very important
project that, for the life of me, I couldn't understand why it wasn't more celebrated. I think hip hop failed in a way. "Us or Else. Look man, you're a guy that's no stranger
to the news cycle to the media.

Rob Markman: We've seen your ups and your
downs. T.I.: Sure. Rob Markman: So, everybody knows who T.I.
Is, and everybody covers T.I. I was really disappointed when you dropped
songs like, "Black Man, "I Believe, "Letter to the System," and they don't spread
as fast as a controversy so to speak.

How did you receive that once that album put out? Did it meet your expectations? Or did the people meet your expectations? T.I.: I had no expectations. I just had some thoughts, some feelings, opinions
that I felt that I had to get out. I had to express myself in music that way. That was the most important thing to me.

The way it was received, I wasn't really tripping
off that. Rob Markman: As a fan, and somebody in the
media, I'm like why can't Black Man be the number one record in the country? Can we get to that? Because we see it all around us. It directly speaks to, still, what's going
on right now. And that was maybe, what? We're talking about two and half years ago,
at this point? 2000 And it was, 15- Rob Markman: Right.

15, 16. Rob Markman: So, on "The Dime Trap, man,
where you going with it? It's the evolution of "Trap Muzik. It's a commemorative album to celebrate the
15th anniversary, but it's definitely evolved to a place where once, trap music was once
the philosophy of present-day dope boys. It has now grown to a place where it is the
philosophy of former, retired dope boys.

And I think that making it through that life,
enduring and overcoming the pitfalls and consequences that come with that lifestyle while not compromising
the morals, standards, and principles that I developed within the lifestyle, the perspective
is much different, but the energy is the same. T.I.: I think about being former drug-dealer
like. The fact that I ain't selling no dope no more,
I ain't got no bricks, no keys, that ain't really the life I'm living. However, it's sort of like if you meet a alcoholic
and he's recovering, he's battling his addiction day to day.

He could've been clean for 10 years. Although he's not waking up everyday going
to have a drink, he could still articulate exactly how alcohol tastes, how it makes you
feel. There are still very, very fond memories,
very vivid pictures in his mind about the things that he experienced while he was trapped
within the lifestyle, while he was battling his addiction. Just because he didn't have a drink today
or yesterday doesn't mean that he can't talk about the effects of it, how it made him feel,
and what it took away from him, and what it gave to him.

That's how I look at us as former drug dealers
making trap music right now. Rob Markman: You know, it's amazing. Trap music is obviously the most, I think,
popular moving genre within hip hop right now. It's no lie, and you're at the forefront and
at the origins of that.

There's a lot of debate that goes on for you,
social media debate. You, Gucci Mane, who started trap music? T.I.: There's no debate. Rob Markman: There is no debate because you
state very clearly that it was T.I. If you check the timeline- T.I.: The great thing about history is it
is documented with dates and facts.

I mean, there's data. So, for us to take our opinion and try to
override that shows that something is terribly wrong with us. There's nothing wrong with the facts. There's something wrong with you, not being
willing to accept the facts.

But I understand it. There were other people who made very significant
contributions to it, that took it places that I didn't, that did things for it that I hadn't. T.I.: What's everybody's favorite phone now? Rob Markman: The iPhone? T.I.: Okay. The iPhone.

Everybody loves the iPhone. We appreciate it, right? It's an evolved apparatus for cellular communication. However, you can never take anything away
from the Motorola block phone. The Motorola block phone was here first.

Rob Markman: Right. T.I.: It was here first. And then, you can't take away nothing from
that. You can't take away nothing away from the
flip phone, from the Nokia chirp.

You know. T.I.: All of the different phones that evolved
from the block phone, they led us up to the iPhone. Rob Markman: To get it where it is today. T.I.: You appreciate the iPhone for what it
is and where it is today, and what you are able to do and use it for, but you can never
discredit ...

You can't never say, "The iPhone was the first cell phone." You'll sound stupid saying that. Rob Markman: Right. T.I.: You'll just sound stupid. T.I.: You know what I'm saying? So, I think that when you have that knowledge
and understanding, it makes it easier for me to accept the outrageousness of others.

Rob Markman: And I bring that up just because
I appreciate the way that you articulated where trap music is and where you're going
with 'The Dime Trap,' just it being this appreciation for, really, guys that changed
they lives. T.I.: Yeah, man. This is a lifestyle. And that's another thing, right? Who would have thought, during the crack epidemic? Knowing that the government made deals with
Nicaragua to get cocaine in exchange for guns, took that cocaine and brought it back here
to our communities, taught someone in ...

Rob Markman: Los Angeles, right. T.I.: Los Angeles how to cook crack, took
that method to make cocaine less expensive, to be affordable by poor people, then changed
the laws to basically enslave us for increasingly large amounts of time, just by adding baking
soda and water and heat to the same substance, so, who knew that from all that destruction
and devastation that the activities that derived from that lifestyle would inspire a music
that we could use to change the lives and lifestyles of our families forever? T.I.: That's a true testament to what the
devil means for bad, God uses for good. I think that's the beauty of trap music. The fact that we narrating our experiences,
but regardless of how heinous the music may sound, or how irresponsible it may come off,
just realize, we could either still be out there selling crack, serving a lifetime in
prison, or dead.

You know what I'm saying? It ain't but so many ways to make it out of
the crack era or the crack epidemic. We took it and turned it into a revenue stream,
and used that to change the lifestyles of our families forever. I think that's pretty fucking dope. Rob Markman: Right.

T.I.: No pun intended. Rob Markman: Pun intended. That's a bar. Look, he got bars even just in his regular
speech.

No man, and I think that's also a testament
to the hustle because it takes- T.I.: Well, see. Another thing. When we talking about the discussion, the
back-and-forth between who did what, I mean, I think that you can't argue with the facts. But, from me just kind of trying to estimate,
how can anybody even argue that? I came up with an answer.

It's because who relates to who? T.I.: Everybody's different. Some people identify with different things
for different reasons. Let's take 'The Wire,' for example. Some people watch 'The Wire,' and they identify
more with Stringer Bell, someone who is in the hustle, and hands-on, and he's doing just
as much dirt, and has just as much to gain or lose from his actions and activities, faced
just as many consequences, solved just as many problems, but he just has an aspirational
view of where he's taking himself.

This is temporary for him. He's doing this right now, but while he's
in this game, he got his mind on building skyscrapers 10 years from now, somehow. So, you may identify with him, or you may
identify with Stringer Bell, the guy with dirt up under his fingernails, who loads his
own pistols, who standing out there on the block all day- T.I.: ... Actually standing over the body,
pow, pow, blood splash on his shirt.

That may be what you identify with. So, if you identify with Stringer Bell, you
gone pretty much side with me. And if you identify with Avon Barksdale, then
you probably gone go the other way. And once I understand that that's why, that
is the real root of it.

It ain't got nothing to do with me personally. They just siding with what they feel looks
more like them? You know what I'm saying? Rob Markman: I can't wait to check out this
album. Just the game that you kicking right now leads
me to believe we in for some shit. T.I.: Man, it's gonna be eventful.

Rob Markman: Yo, man. This is For The Record man. I want to do a quick game with you, word association. Rob Markman: For a little segment we call
"Record Break, I'm just going to throw out at you rapid fire questions, and you
answer the first thing that comes into your mind.

You ready? Cool. What's the record that made you want to rap? T.I.: "I'm Bad, by LL Cool J. Rob Markman: That's a good record. It's a great record.

Rob Markman: You got a long discography, now. What's T.I.'S best record, in T.I's opinion? T.I.: 'The Dime Trap.' Rob Markman: Just like that. Rob Markman: We got to see. I got to get this record, man.

Rob Markman: What's the one record that wasn't
yours that you hear and wish that you wrote? T.I.: I don't really hear nothing and wish
that I wrote it but I've heard records that I had, that were mine, and I didn't use them
quick enough and they came out later to become hits. T.I.: "Stir Fry" is one of them. Rob Markman: What's another one? T.I.: Nicki Minaj, Did It On Em. Rob Markman: You had that? That's Bangladesh beat.

T.I.: Yeah, Bangladesh. Bangladesh brought that to me first. Yep. Yep.

There's a few of them. Those two, they stand out to me the most. T.I.: Oh, well, this is one record that was
mine that I didn't ... O.T.

Genesis, "Cash On it? It was going to be on "The Dime Trap. I didn't move on it fast enough. He said, "Man, I'm gone just use it for me." "It's cool." I'm like, "Damn, bruh." Alright. Cool.

Let me see here. Those are the ones that just come and jump
off at me right off top, but I experienced those moments more times than that. Rob Markman: You've collaborated a lot with
the all time greatest, from Little Wayne, to Jay-Z, to Eminem. The list is endless.

And you hold your own. You're a damn fine MC. T.I.: Oh, I'm gonna burn your ass up in there,
you come in there playing around. Don't get it tangled up, twisted now.

Rob Markman: What's the one record you felt
like you might have got got on by somebody? Was it anybody? T.I.: Man, you got, "I'm Sorry" with Andre
3000 on 'Trouble Man.' Which record was that? Was it the Killer Mike ... The "Action Remix"
with Bun B? Rob Markman: Right. T.I.: Yeah, Bun B fired my ass up. Welcome to the rap game.

Those are the only two that really,
really stuck out. Rob Markman: I mean this, if you gone get
burned by some ... Andre 3000, Bun B are not- T.I.: Then, arguably, Eminem on- Rob Markman: Was it "Touchdown, was it? T.I.: "Touchdown, was it "Touchdown?" I think I might have got him on "Touchdown. I think I'm talking about "That's All She
Wrote.

It's one or the other, one or the other. Rob Markman: And you've burned many MCs
in your days. T.I.: Oh, yeah, man, swore it, stay driven. Swore it, stay driven.

Rob Markman: Alright, man. Two more things before we head out of here,
man. Now hip hop is full of these mysteries, these
urban legends that we just are dying to solve. Recently on Drake's album, Jay-Z, once again
confirmed that he did, indeed, lose 90 bricks.

And we're all trying to figure out how that
happened. That make my stomach hurt right
now. Rob Markman: It's been said that the Nick
player that Biggie was talking about on "...Story to Tell", it hadn't been confirmed, is the
late, great, Anthony Mason. That was another hip hop mystery that has
solved.

I wanted to know if we can solve one today. T.I.: What is that? Rob Markman: I want to know if we can still
clear up who T.I. Was aiming at on, "I'm Talkin' to You?" That's one of the great hip hop mysteries. T.I.: Hey man.

Just to be honest with you, the concept for
"I'm Talkin' to You" was really based on "How can I send several messages out?" Just in
case somebody might have been thinking sideways about me. T.I.: It was for the people who have quiet
conversations covertly, without me knowing. The things I never hear about in rooms that
I'm not in, how can I speak to them? I say, "Well, if I talk to everybody I'm not
talking to, then, if I don't say their names, and they were talking about me then they would
automatically know I'm talking to them. But, if I don't say their names, and they
weren't talking about me, they have no reason to feel guilty.

That was my approach. Rob Markman: Art of war. Nobody took the bait though, right? I felt like nobody felt froggy enough. T.I.: Listen man, don't nobody want this kind
of pressure man.

This shit tough now. You got to bring some ass to get some. Shit, sometime you can't save ass and your
face at the same time. You got to choose one.

You save your ass, you gone lose your face. You save your face, you gone lose your ass. I think people want challenges that they can
kind of dictate whether or not they're going to come out successful. They don't want this.

They don't want these issues. Rob Markman: That's a great answer. That's a excellent dance by the way, man. It makes all the sense in the world.

That was great footwork. We still didn't get the name we was looking
for, so we'll- T.I.: Ain't no name. Ain't no name. Man, it's a long list of suckers in my book,
at different times in my life I think back, and like, "Man, they hating,
man." "They don't want to see me make it." "They scared I'm coming for they spot." And you know, this is just conversations that,
as competitors, this is how we speak to ourselves.

This is how we feel. Sometimes we could be being paranoid, and
other times we could be right on the money, but just ain't got the substantiated justification
to actually take the action or initiative that we think we should. So, like I said, you got to find broad ways
to spread out in different directions. Rob Markman: Right.

No I hear you man. TIP, man, always love. It's always a pleasure to be able to talk
with you, get that insight from you. This show is For The Record, so I want to
leave you with this.

At the end of the show, we ask every guest
to just finish the sentence to clear up whatever they might wanted to clear up, or anything
they want the people to know. So the floor is yours, if you can finish this
sentence. "For the record T.I.: For the record, trap music was conceived
on I'm Serious, with Dope Boyz, and "Trap Nigga. It was permanently established August 19th,
2003.

No cap. Rob Markman: And there you got it. Rob Markman: T.I., Man, thank you for coming
through. T.I.: Right on, bro.

Rob Markman: Love. T.I.: The Dime Trap. Cometh..

T.I. Discusses The Origins Of Trap Music, Ye Vs. The People & The Dime TrapFor The Record

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